Arkansas Canoe Club Forums

After 12 years of floating the Mulberry, I was pulled over by the law (AG$F) for the first time today. It was just down stream of the Indian Creek put-in or Indian Creek Ford.

They were checking for the normal stuff, trash bag, glass, life jackets, and if I had a rod I'm sure they would have checked for a permit.

Our group got away clean as we were all in compliance (sort of), but many people were getting pinched. Watch out.

kru

Kru- you're lucky they didn't write you a ticket for "boating below fun levels"-M-

Question: Do kayakers have to carry a mesh trash bag? If so, is there a certain size it has to be?

I think most of us kayakers carry an onion bag clipped in behind the seat. We don't generate too much trash, since we can't carry an ice chest full of beer like the canoers do. We have it mostly to pick up trash we see.

Nothing new. They set up there all the time. What I thought was a joke is I counted 8 of them sitting in lawn chairs with binoculars and 2 in yaks paddling out to meet/inspect boats. They were polite enough but what a waste of dollars to get paid sitting in lawn chairs on the river doing nothing.

Having that many officers in one place seems like a wasteful use of the funding the AGFC receives through permit fees, state tax, fines and fundraising. On the Kings, a while back, they had 2 officers at a bend where the river choked down. They were real efficient in checking and fining.

I saw Ryan's FB post last night and made a mental note to disseminate a little info. A mesh litter bag is not required. A sturdy container secured to the boat is. The problems are:

1. Whether a container qualifies as sturdy is up to the LEO.
2. It seems most (all?) of the LEOs STILL don't know the mesh bag requirement was officially amended some time ago. This is very troubling as it is not a recent development and is something a two minute conversation would rectify.

We encountered a similar situation last summer at Surf and Turf. There was a law enforcement strainer comprising AGFC officers and some kids acting in some sort of auxiliary enforcement capacity. No one could (or would) tell me what they were doing there. The wardens issued a bunch of citations for glass, loose trash in boats, lack of PFDs, etc. As I recall they even confiscated some drugs. I agree the book should have been thrown at those types of offenders. I didn't have a mesh bag. I did have a clipped in soft cooler with all my (and others') empties zipped inside. I tried to explain that mesh bags were no longer required and one could instead have a secure container. It was like talking to a robot. I accepted the warning citation, thanked them for their service and headed down river.

Monday morning I called their boss. He apologized and promised to personally contact the head of that division and tell him to educate his officers. Whether he did I don't know, but I encourage Kristian or Ryan or someone to do the same. Based on Ryan's account it sounds like most people were in compliance and shouldn't have been cited. I'll dig up the thread with the head of enforcement's contact info and post it here.

I found the old thread. At that time (pushing two years ago) the head of enforcement was Major Callaway. I'd forgotten, but after the Surf and Turf encounters Doug Webber printed and laminated copies of the amended statute. I told Major Callaway I didn't think his officers would enjoy being presented with one in the midst of an enforcement situation and the much better alternative would be the five minutes of training required to bring them up to speed on the laws they were there to enforce. He agreed. Call him.

We had the head of enforcement at a Central Chapter meeting last year and it was a productive conversation. Evidently not all officers (AGFC) have been "retrained" regarding some of the finer points of the litter law. Most of those who are following this thread know what the statute says and abide by it without exception. It is the general casual floating public that needs education.

I spoke with one the the people who got ticketed.
He had Ice Chest that locked "which he also had strapped".
He had "1 empty can in the chest and was ticketed" because he had no mesh container.

I don't believe anyone "decked with a sprayskirt" was asked over.
The Rec's and OC's were all being checked.

Prairie Tater wrote: Question: Do kayakers have to carry a mesh trash bag? If so, is there a certain size it has to be?

Sorry Terry, I forgot to address your question. According to the law a mesh bag is NOT required provided there's another form of secure containment aboard.

Tim Eubanks wrote:We had the head of enforcement at a Central Chapter meeting last year and it was a productive conversation. Evidently not all officers (AGFC) have been "retrained" regarding some of the finer points of the litter law. Most of those who are following this thread know what the statute says and abide by it without exception. It is the general casual floating public that needs education.

FWIW he's no longer head of enforcement. He moved up the chain and was replaced by Major Callaway who seemed equally receptive to public input when I spoke with him. Ryan says the orificers on the Mulberry were indeed USFS.

I recall the threads from some time ago. But, since I kept hearing about people continuing to be ticketed for not having a mesh bag, even if they had a restrained, closed container, I've continued carrying a mesh bag. Does the current law require a closed container? Is a mesh bag an acceptable form of containment for trash?
Quoting the law to law enforcement often doesn't seem to work and they might be offended and look for something else.

The following is copied and pasted directly from the AGFC web site.

Attach and Use a Trash Container

All canoes, kayaks, inner tubes and other vessels easily susceptible to swamping, tipping or rolling carrying food or beverages must have an attached closeable trash container. The container must be of sturdy construction, or it may be a bag of mesh construction. All trash must be safely and lawfully disposed of. A container is not required for people traveling without foodstuffs or beverages.

Seems pretty clear to me.

They all were both forrest service and Game and Fish. The dude in the sit on top identified himself as arkansas game and fish.