Arkansas Canoe Club Forums

okieboater wrote:The times they are a changing!

That they are Mr. Dave.

I have never wanted nor felt that I needed a gun at any time. I know if anyone ever pulled a gun on me it would be the last thing they ever did, unless they killed me on the spot.

You know, I made the comment that I wasn't sure what I expected, but that's not the case at all. In retrospect what I got is exactly what I expected fron this bunch, a nice mix of well considered and humorous input. Thanks guys. Gives me a lot to think about.

Curious: Can anyone relate at least one documented incident of a hostile encounter between maleantes and innocents in natural settings in Arkansas or Missouri? Robbery, theft, beatings, killings, etc.?

I don't doubt such events, but just wonder about the risk and whether it is high enough to worry about, as the poster inquired.

The only time I have ever been somewhat threatened happened to me on HWY 19 between Salem and Eminence, MO back in April on my way to join LA, AR, and MO paddlers. I was rollercoastering my pickup and enjoying the striking natural beauty of the country when some local dude decided to push adrenaline by road raging the out of stater. I tried to keep a cool hand, maintaining a steady and safe pace as he rode my bumper for several miles, NASCAR drafting fashion. That effing close. Not pulling over seemed to be the safest thing to do. What other steel might this guy be bearing?

OK. One event out of a hundred dominated almost entirely by the kindest and gentlest people you will meet anywhere. But this one event, coupled with my reading of 'Almost Midnight' and my watching of 'Winter's Bone' (meth heads the central characters of both), and, OK, add 'The Road', was enough to put the spook goblin to work in my head.

I am resistant to handguns. I actually hate em due to some tragic family history. But I am not anti gun. I do hunt deer and keep a shotgun handy at home. I often do venture solo on the rivers and trails. It is my release from the cosmic prison. Some things just need to stay behind.

This answers nothing. But reflects the deep ambivalence and uncertainty of being me in this time.

I was camping at High Burr bluff on the lower Buffalo this weekend. I was sleeping under the kitchen fly. At 2:30 AM I heard a noise and a bear was trying to get into my cooler which was 15 feet away. My flashlight caused him to abandon the effort. In the morning we found tracks where he got to within 10 feet of my cot. I ALWAYS carry a pistol on such trips and will be taking it to Idaho in three weeks where the bears are bigger. Glad I did not need it this time.

Rick Ramsay wrote:I was camping at High Burr bluff on the lower Buffalo this weekend. I was sleeping under the kitchen fly. At 2:30 AM I heard a noise and a bear was trying to get into my cooler which was 15 feet away. My flashlight caused him to abandon the effort. In the morning we found tracks where he got to within 10 feet of my cot. I ALWAYS carry a pistol on such trips and will be taking it to Idaho in three weeks where the bears are bigger. Glad I did not need it this time.

Reeeally. On the Buffy, huh? I'll be darned. I always joke with Mrs. Deuce about my Yeti being bear "proof", but you're making me wonder whether I ought to get one of those locks for it.

I cannot remember the exact date but some years ago at a federal campground in central AR, I remember an incident where escaped convicts killed a couple camping.

Any one else remember the details on this?

No specifics.. but I know of 2 different "situations." Friends of friends in both, a few years ago. Very much physical injury. One case was meth heads... they were caught later.

Also a case from south LA

Lou,
check this out
http://www.southeasternoutdoors.com/out ... parks.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.southeasternoutdoors.com/out ... rders.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

not specifically AR and a bit old info but still interesting.

dave

lou wrote:Curious: Can anyone relate at least one documented incident of a hostile encounter between maleantes and innocents in natural settings in Arkansas or Missouri? Robbery, theft, beatings, killings, etc.?

I don't doubt such events, but just wonder about the risk and whether it is high enough to worry about, as the poster inquired.

http://www.amw.com/fugitives/case.cfm?i ... &refresh=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
This one didn’t start in the woods, but I’m betting if you had stumbled across the killer while he was hiding the body near Turner Bend, you would have been in grave danger.

http://www.cncpunishment.com/forums/sho ... -Death-Row" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
This one happened on a 4WD road / hiking trail within one mile of Long Pool Campground (Big Piney Creek). This was on the same road some of us used to drive to the Mother when we didn’t have time or a shuttle to float the whole river. I had driven that road both before, and after this murder.

There are risks in owning a firearm. There are risks in not owning a firearm. I’m just glad that those of us who have lived responsible, non-violent lives each get the chance to weigh those risks and make our own decision.

I have met a few ?? in my time in the woods. Never quite to the point I woulda pulled it out. Just left in a hurry.

On the other hand, I have met waaayy more wonderful folks that have been extremely helpful in nasty situations. Great chats on the hiking trail, last minute hookups to shuttle and run the river, assistance in a pickle. Many miles of motorcycle touring, leaving stuff at the road or trailhead and the only time anything was stolen off the bike I left behind was in the city just outside the door where I worked.

I just wanted to flip the coin. There are plenty of great folks ready to do the right thing and go above and beyond out there.

but.......

Dave and Cowper,

Thanks for the response to my inquiry.

I have to admit that I have considered the hand cannon option. My arm gun just ain't the rock thrower that it used to be ("Mr. Umpire, Mr. Umpire! That kid gonna knock all our kids' teeth out!". I was fast, but a bit wild.)

lou wrote:Dave and Cowper,

Thanks for the response to my inquiry.

I have to admit that I have considered the hand cannon option. My arm gun just ain't the rock thrower that it used to be ("Mr. Umpire, Mr. Umpire! That kid gonna knock all our kids' teeth out!". I was fast, but a bit wild.)

LOL! Yeah, I'm sure there's more than one shoulder around here that ain't what it used to be. I'm looking to the left and right at a couple right now.

Got to agree with the weak shoulder comments.

For most of my life I had the physical abilities to either stand my ground or run fast to get away with good confidence in both options.

Alas, those days are pretty much gone forever. Shoulder, lower back and hip joints are pretty much gone.

The sad part of this whole situation is more and more "peace full" campers etc feel the need to carry some sort of protection while enjoying the outdoors. Protection from other humans, not forest animals.

I am partial to UDAP bear spray as it is much easier to hit the target with a room size spray than a firearm's bullet. Not recommended for use on humans, but if it stops a charging grizzly bear it should work in an emergency on other charging "animals" as well.

"We are sure that when retirement begins, childhood restarts"

Good thing my shoulders have hit the skid cause I might just be tempted to resurrect that atavistic childhood sport of making a tomato meet car traveling 60mph. God, if one life itself ain't a couple million years of human evolution. Stone age meet rocket age or so it seems.