Crossover Kayaks...? Opinions?

[okieboater]

I have heard so many good reports on the Remix and XP version of the Remix, that I found a used Remix and purchased same just to find out if they perform as well as everyone sez they do. Remix large version is what I have. No chance yet to get it on real rapids but it sure does paddle nicely on the easy stuff. Paddles a lot like my much loved RPM Max except much more volume in the stern. Looking forward to getting the Remix out west on some big water runs where it is supposed to shine.

No way will I get rid of the Max for around here but the Remix might replace my Response as the kayak of choice for western big volume runs.

Not sure what this has to do with the original post, but I have been following this thread with interest.

Bottom Line is: Hard to find a standard Remix or XP version owner who is not happy with their boat. And, I monitor a lot of kayak message boards.

[RomanLA]

I have heard so many good reports on the Remix and XP version of the Remix, that I found a used Remix and purchased same just to find out if they perform as well as everyone sez they do. Remix large version is what I have. No chance yet to get it on real rapids but it sure does paddle nicely on the easy stuff. Paddles a lot like my much loved RPM Max except much more volume in the stern. Looking forward to getting the Remix out west on some big water runs where it is supposed to shine.

If you watch the high water North Fork Payette scene in the WildWater movie, nearly every paddler is in a Remix. The fact that these are a bunch of unsponsored world class paddlers, speaks volumes in my mind. I definitely plan to pickup a Remix 79 in the near future. I'm also going to add a Burn to my quiver soon though! lol

LL and Pyranha are both great companies and both have a bunch of great designs! That should sufficiently add to the confusion of this thread! :)

[okieboater]

My take on the Burn is it is a great boat but takes a experienced hard driving boater to get it doing what it does best.

I had a large Burn and long as I paddled it aggressively and watched the edges in funny water and upgraded the outfitting to a perfect custom fit, it was a great boat.

Unfortunately, my style of creeking is the float with the current that takes me where I want to go, see the move and aggressively burst paddle as needed then back to floating with the current. For my style of creeking I felt I had to take care of the Burn in funny water more than I felt it took care of me.

I sold my Burn to a very good aggressive boater and he is absolutely happy with the boat. I know some world class kayakers that just love the Burn for all around boating.

I like a creek kayak that takes care of me in funny water currents and that is maybe why I like the old Jackson Mega Rocker so much for runs that challenge (make that scare) me. The Mega Rocker is old school displacement, really round front and sides that do not seem to catch on any crazy currents in deep water or slides over rocks like greased lightning. Having said that my favorite river runner is a 1996 RPM Max - a boat known for its ability to stern squirt if not paddled from a chest forward position. My take on the Remix 79 I just got is it is going to be a "forgiving" kayak in funny water but when paddled aggressively on a selected line - it gets the job done just fine. The more I paddle the Remix 79 the more I like it. Seems to have a good deal of speed for a modern design. The Remix 79 might well be a heck of a western big water boat with the speed, comfort and forgiving edges it has.

The more I hear about the Remix XP for self support, the more I like it. Just out of storage space in the boat shed.

[jerryc]

a cup of water would make it a "wet" hatch

Well maybe a damp hatch, it certainly ships less water than the Axis. Has always stayed bone dry on many Buffalo and Mulberry runs. I figure the roll clinic was a pretty extreme test.

[Fish]

Before this thread I thought a crossover kayak was one outfitted as a C-1. Learn somethin new everyday.

I know you can't have a better test of a boat than what Roman had in the GC. Thanks again for the invite Roman - you're a Canyon kayaker now my man!

- Fish

[Cowper]

Ditto Fish's comments to Roman!

Re the kayaks; being an old school boater who started out in a world where anything less than 13'-2" was considered a "short" kayak, if it wasn't for the skeg I wouldn't really even think of the XP-10 as being so much as being a cross-over boat as just a full-on WW boat especially suited for the 200# plus crowd, or for lighter folks who really value volume and stability. If the Fusion has a bulkhead footbrace, a slightly less comfortable seat, and is even more towards the "big creek boat" end of the spectrum, is it really even a cross-over? (I'm not really asking, so much as just throwing out some food for thought.) From the reviews, I'm sure it is a good boat, I'm just trying to help sort through the marketing hype and suggesting that everyone consider, what type of boat are you really looking for?

If you want a cross-over, that says to me you want more speed and tracking and good performance in pools and Class I/II than what WW boats provide, and a really comfortable seat and the ability to stretch your legs would both be important features for all-day enjoyment. If I get an XP-10, it is not the boat I will choose for hucking waterfalls, so footpegs will be fine, and much easier to adjust when loaning the boat to others, plus easier access to the front as already mentioned by Roman.

The original poster is already on the right track because he's trying to sit in or paddle the boats he is considering. I say think hard about where you will REALLY use the boat, get one that is both fast and comfortable. Also, consider the strength of your roll; if you're near 100% in the kind of water where you would be paddling the boat, then stability of the boat is not an issue you need to factor in. If you don't roll or roll up only some of the time, then choose a stable boat that makes the need for a roll unlikely.

[RomanLA]

I know you can't have a better test of a boat than what Roman had in the GC. Thanks again for the invite Roman - you're a Canyon kayaker now my man!

Ditto Fish's comments to Roman!

Thanks y'all! The only problem is now I'm addicted to big water paddling! lol

p.s. I'd rather be at Lava Falls!

[okieboater]

Sounds like the new XP 10 did good for you.

How about a test report?

[RomanLA]

How about a test report?

It sounds like most of the strengths and weaknesses have been covered, so I'll just point out a few things that stood out to me.

First of all, it's really fast! It didn't take me long to figure out that I was the fastest thing on the river. I had to give lots of room not only to the rafts, but also to the other kayakers when entering rapids. I don't take many strokes, but I still was gaining on everyone very quickly. Most days I just opted to paddle up in front of the lead raft.

The boat is extremely stable. It's definitely more noticeable in small water. I took it to a whitewater park and never managed to flip it. In big water, the stuff that flipped me would have flipped any kayak (big laterals and crashing waves). In my opinion, the stability came more into play when rolling up. Once it was upright the primary stability kicked in and gave you a really stable platform to recover and get your bearings.

The skeg just makes life better. I ran rapids with both the skeg up and the skeg down. If it was "hey diddle diddle right down the middle", I didn't bother raising the skeg. That included some big name rapids like Horn and Lava Falls. It just made it that much easier to stay on line at the top and to power through the "hippo water" at the bottom. Where I really noticed the skeg was when I forgot it was up in the pools. It wouldn't take me long to realize I was making more corrections strokes than usual and put it back down.

The storage hatch is nice, even when you have raft support. I had a 20L dry bag in the back for day use. I used it for stuff like extra snacks, hiking shirt/shorts/hat, sunscreen, and sunglasses case. I also threw my sandals back there. I didn't go too crazy to keep the weight down. I put my normal 10L dry bag (pin kit, first aid kit, survival kit, etc.) and throw rope behind the seat to keep the weight centered. The hatch does have a tendency to stick at times. It was easy to pop open with a rescue knife though.

In my opinion, the only major drawback is the size/weight on land. With gear in it, it's definitely easier to move around with two people. Once you put it in the water though, it just feels like any other whitewater boat. Especially once you dial in the outfitting and get a good fit.

I've gotta run, but if I think of anything else, I'll add it later.

[okieboater]

Thanks Roman, that is the kind of info I was looking for.

I just finished a 5 day kayak self support float in my vintage Prijon Chopper. Had plenty of room in the stern, but with all the gear I had back there, I had to move the seat all the way forward and do my best ever chest forward hinge to keep the boat stable. It was still a bit tippy!

No problem understanding the weight on land as moving my Chopper on the ground took two of us.

A XP 10 might show up for my next kayak self support trip sometimes in the future.

thanks again for the info