Cadron Creek Hazard

[Allen Rittman]

Impact or Tetra or any other company that has anything to do with all this drilling could care less whether someone gets hurt or not. And they will pump water from the Cadron until it is dry and there is nothing anyone can do. After they pump the creek dry they will bring in a bull dozer and push up a dam to build a catch basin. From what I've seen they could care less about there impact on the enviroment and what's above ground. It's all about money and if someone gets hurt or killed on the Cadon or anyother stream in Arkansas they have plenty of Money and Lawers to cover everything up and pay everybody off. Like I told a friend a few years ago when all this started. "By the time all this is over everyone will be sick of these drilling company's and everything that comes with it". Well except for the Money! Look at what they are doing to the raods with all the extra heavy truck traffic. And before this is over they will be doing this in every creek we paddle in. It's a real sham these guys are ripping our state apart and could care less! This is just my observation and opinion and is not directed at any individuals.

[rynorris]

THAT AIN'T RIGHT!!!!

[Randy Dodson]

don't sugar coat it like that Allen, tell us how you really feel.

[Allen Rittman]

Yeah, I kinda liked our state the way it was! I'll try and be at little more stright forward next time. I know I get long winded sometimes and beat around the bush. If you start adding up the trees they have cleared for drilling and for the pipe lines they put in the ground. I'm not sure what the number is but I'm pretty sure its a big one! And trees will NEVER be able to be grown in these areas again Forest land lost for good. It's not like they are clear cutting and are going to plant trees back for future generations. Now they want to pump the creeks dry, only to get what they want MONEY, GREED, POWER. Hopefully they will get what they want without too much more distruction and be gone forever.

[gannon311]

this is bad to say but do you think we could get a man made park out of this.there's really not anything we can do about the pipelines and pads but maybe we can get something out of this.as you see 2 or 300,000 is nothing to them.they might give it for us to shut up.that wrong but there going to do it anyway might as well get something out of it

[Trismegistus]

I hear ya Raftdog -- albeit the trees won't be gone for good -- just for our lifetime. There will come a day when the pipelines go empty and the wells are capped off and nature will reclaim what is rightfully hers. Until them -- ugly and harmful.

A plus: I now have a great slide collection entitled "Oil Pursuits and their Environmental Implications" -- loss of habitat, erosion and sedimentation of our rivers and streams, clear cuts, gravel beds and open quarries, ground and surface water depletion, gates, fences and restrictions to overland passage, ad infinitum.

And of course the bewilderment that what's bad for the Arctic Wildlife Refuge is somehow good for the state -- go figure!

[Cowper]

OK, got to make a couple of comments here. Hazard? Yes, to the extent that it is something you should be on the outlook for when you run the creek, just as Chester suggested.

But relatively speaking, how much hazard? This is a rope, visible from upstream if you're looking for it, not barbed wire, and is located in a relatively slower section of the river. Anyone who can not recognize and safely negotiate this hazard really shouldn't be running any of the rapids on Cadron - you're not ready yet. So my concern would be that if we call state agencies or the Company to complain about this one as a safety hazard, we will just sound like crackpots.

Pumping the creek dry, from a floater's perspective? I don't think so. 10 cfs = 4489 gpm; those pumps are probably in the 2500 to 5000 gpm range. So let's call it 4489, just for grins. How long would it have to pump to get the 500,000 gallons mentioned elsewhere? Only 111 minutes, less than two hours. At 2.0 feet, Cadron is running over 200 cfs, so we really won't miss this 10 cfs at any RUNNABLE level.

Am I saying "no worries"? ABSOLUTELY NOT WHAT I AM SAYING!
Looking at the 53 year historical average for Cadron, it is normally less than 10 cfs for all of August and most of July. So going from "greater than zero, but less than 10" cfs, to ZERO cfs for a couple of months in the summer, has TREMENDOUS potential environmental impact on this stream. And this is assuming the one pump site is the ONLY one; who knows how many more will be needed later, or what is already there further upstream, or up on some tributary sucking up the water before it ever makes it down to Cadron?

In my mind, the big concern is neither boater safety nor "boatable water" -the concern is guaranteeing a minimum low flow that will prevent dramatic changes in the river ecology. If you are motivated to call or write someone, please don't hand them something that is easily dismissed - give them the tough questions, like, "how can we guarantee the river won't be sucked dry several months per year, and what will that do to the fish and other wildlife?"

[Crane]

Good points, all. Still, folks simply do not need to be stringing ropes across rivers... That's why, when it's necessary to do so, Swiftwater folks put spotters above any rope to warn on-coming folks... Sure, competent folks probably can identify the hazard and avoid it... if they see it... if... if... if... Better for it not to be there at all.

[Trismegistus]

"Folks simply do not need to be stringing ropes across rivers"

Amen. Albeit I hear where you're coming from Cowper. But with six inches of rain on the creek that rope may now be a deadly hazard. And with heavy rain and dark skies even a large rope strung at eye level can appear suddenly and without warning on any stream at any time.

Secondly -- and again I couldn't agree more -- "Anyone who can not recognize and safely negotiate this hazard really shouldn't be running any of the rapids on Cadron - you're not ready yet." Another amen. The problem is the creek is far too popular and accessible with folks that can't even keep a boat upright on dry land. Big rain like this -- 6 inches in last 24 hours and counting -- you never know when some guy that's never been in a boat before gonnna think he can beat the creek. Turned many away over the years.

P.S. For once we should be thankful we have some trees to help suck up some of this water. Were this mid-winter there would be some flooding unlike we've ever seen....

[Trismegistus]

And speaking of lines and wires crossing the creek I met with Shawn Ware, Permit Agent with Kingfisher Exploration Services this morning to discuss further 3D seismic exploration on the Cadron. He indicated that SEECO is planning on another seismic survey this fall with all new blast holes, etc. This likely means you are going to see even more cables stretched across the creek, more water being pumped from the creek and even more folks and equipment scattered across the forested hillsides.

Be careful out there!

Question: Rumors are numerous. Folks are looking at the new pipeline infrastructure that is being laid down and can now appreciate the volume of gas that is about to be extracted from our state. And although everyone wants to "own a gas well" no one actually wants one on their property. But it looks like there is going to be a lot of wells -- even thousands upon thousands of them. Now here's the question -- I have heard from different people that there are going to be several wells within a given section -- I have heard as many as 10-12 wells per section and even more -- just how many wells are there going to be on a per section basis on average?