Buffalo River Closure???

[Roger]

I am personally more concerned about the children and adult cancer patients who are not getting their treatments because the CR bill passed by the house to fully fund NIH was rejected by the Senate and by the Executive branch. Make it hurt. This is a legacy issue for one pliticuian who has drawn a red line at any delay proposals (in spite of having himself granted delays and exemptions to constituants) and refuses to consider negotiations.

This legislation was passed in 2010. Ruled constitutional by SCOTUS. Reaffirmed by 2012 electoral results. That one politician you reference has no reason to negotiate on that matter.

It's a government shutdown. Who get's to pick and choose who is essential? Sounds like all of them are based on the "loyal" opposition. Lots of people hurt here. If this legislation is bad as some say it is, then let it fail on its own. Fact is Arkansas is not promoting this benefit to its citizens due to ideology.

Need new talking points.

[Yarbrough]

The house of Representatives are doing what they campaigned on in 2012. Making it hurt is just asinine. There is no reason for war veterans and elk to be used as pawns.

[Canoe_Codger]

Please. Don't make me post again. Feed the elk!

Ok, I'll post. The Wisconsin Governor is forcing open some Federal funded state sites that USFWS has barracaded, using agreements with the State as the basis. Does Arkansas have any legal agreements regarding public access to the Buffalo River from when they turned the State Park over to the Feds? Or am I just peeing into the stream because of State politician support of the Democratic National mandates to "make it hurt"?

Michael

[hollohead]

Need new talking points.? C'mon Roger, Canoe Codger made several good points, just as you did. You both left out the facts that the law was passed without the 60 votes required on major legislation in the senate, also, scotus ruled the law was a new tax, exactly what the Obama administration said it wasn't. This is exactly why I hate politics, both of you made excellent and valid points, but the answer is somewhere in the middle. If you find yourself never straying from your political leanings, then it's time for some perspective. Please take no offense, none is intended.

[mgood]

Codger-

I've had the great misfortune to be doing a TON of research lately on the legislative history of the buffalo. It's interesting but dull. The federal government owns all the land, and the state really couldn't make much of a legitimate claim if it tried. You could try hiking on some of the tributaries outside the park boundary, but you may get sprayed with pig feces if you manage to pick the wrong one- that's another discussion for another day though.

[Canoe_Codger]

The State does own the bridges and highway easements though, right? Yeah, grasping at straws I know.

I am proud of our WWII vets for practicing civil disobedience and removing barricades from memorials though. The USMC Iwo Jima memorial in Virginia being the latest.

My Sisterinlaw is one of the cancer victims (stage 4 ovarian) whose access to clinical trials medicines via the NIH has been blocked by this. The funding bill (passed by the house per law) sits in the Senate with no action being taken.

[Cowper]

Yes, some stupid decisions are being made. But please provide a reference documenting that there are
"Democratic National mandates to "make it hurt"."

On a happier note, when I went to the USGS web page, I found this:

"October 1, 2013 - Due to a lapse in Federal funding, the U.S. Geological Survey must suspend those parts of its data collection and distribution processes requiring human intervention. However, automated reporting and serving of telemetered data will continue.
Users may note some degradation in the quality and completeness of real-time streamflow, groundwater levels and water-quality data from some reporting stations due to the suspension of field calibrations and adjustments, especially as high flows occur, aquatic vegetation becomes dominant, or ice forms in high altitude streams. The USGS will continue to monitor some performance aspects of its network using a skeleton workforce."

I call that a "happier note" because that is how all government services should be right now - degraded due to the missing folks, but not spending extra resources trying to make it worse (like erecting barricades where none existed on public lands). The USGS is saying simply, "we'll do our best to continue serving you, using whatever resources we have available. Please understand the gaps." BRAVO USGS!

[Canoe_Codger]

The Park Service appears to be closing streets on mere whim and caprice. The rangers even closed the parking lot at Mount Vernon, where the plantation home of George Washington is a favorite tourist destination. That was after they barred the new World War II Memorial on the Mall to veterans of World War II. But the government does not own Mount Vernon; it is privately owned by the Mount Vernon Ladies' Association. The ladies bought it years ago to preserve it as a national memorial. The feds closed access to the parking lots this week, even though the lots are jointly owned with the Mount Vernon ladies. The rangers are from the government, and they’re only here to help.

“It’s a cheap way to deal with the situation,” an angry Park Service ranger in Washington says of the harassment. “We’ve been told to make life as difficult for people as we can. It’s disgusting.”
Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/201 ... z2gyoXwr00" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Make it hurt. NPS is a favorite pawn of whatever political party controls the Executive branch. Several former officials of the USDI have admitted this. Couldn't close Mount Vernon? Closed the parking lots. Same for Mount Rushmore. In fact they are employing more people policing major monuments than normally staff some of them when they are open. Political theater pure and simple. I can list the CR appropriation bills passed by the House and sent to the Senate if you wish. Some were unanamously passed by both parties, but the Senate refuses to act on them.

[Mike S]

Spent the last week up near Jasper everything was closed as far as park stuff to include Lost Vally, Sams Throne, Alum Cove, Richland Creek and Kyles landing Even the rest stop on 7 north of Dover was closed they all had the same tactic road block off to the side of the road saying due to a lapse of government funding this area is closed! That being said the only way this affected me was the locked bathrooms we simply drove around the barricades and hiked at all of the above areas!

[Cowper]

An idea is forming in my head.

OK, both "sides" are blaming the other for this shutdown. I don't want to get into that right now, 'cause we're not going to get agreement and we're probably not going to convince each other who is right by yelling on the internet. (I'm right, you're wrong, in case you were wondering)

BUT - Both sides do seem to have broad agreement about certain aspects of this shutdown that were "wrong", or how to deal with them. For example, within the last couple of days, the house passed a bill guaranteeing government workers would get back pay when this all ends. It passed 400-something to 1. I think both sides would agree on other things, although maybe not by that same margin. Trying to prevent World War II vets from visiting an open-air memorial, by blocking off a public sidewalk? Not a good idea, and certainly did not save money since maintenance folks had to set up the barrier (they could have stayed home), and extra enforcement folks had to be called in to deal with the ruckus.
Shutting down information websites, while leaving the services they give information about up and running (that's what happened with Amber Alerts, in case you didn't catch the news) - another "not brilliant" idea.

SO - once the government is up and running again, maybe we need some new legislation that "guides" future shutdowns. Set some ground rules - like don't close national memorials; don't close wildernesses areas where enforcement remains the same open or closed, don't close National Forests, lock the bathroom door if there is no maintenance staff, but don't run around putting yellow tape across dirt roads or forest paths. And identify a more complete list of what we consider to be "vital" functions. There's a very SMART message on the USGS website - it says the sites are going to remain up and running, but that users should understand the quality may degrade because they can't dispatch technicians to do field repairs and calibrations. They basically promised they would just keep on doing the best they could with a skeleton staff.

So maybe when this is over, we can get some new legislation to "guide" future shutdowns. I don't want to just send another e-mail that will get lost among the 1000's of other communications each legislator is receiving right now, so if anyone has suggestions on how to build interest in this idea or get it to someone with the power to give it legs and let it run, let me know.

[Prairie Tater]

I Like your idea, Cowper. Too bad it makes so much sense.

BTW, it looks like we'll probably be seeing a lot of little orange cones in the next few weeks!

[hollohead]

Great idea Cooper, middle of the road compromise, which sad to say, means no shot at all.

[Mike S]

Cowper for president!! 2016

[jermdog]

I got to tell you, Flagstaff is full of angry boatmen, tourists, and boaters. My company had to cancel a trip this weekend and it doesn't look good for my next trip. This is some bull sh...

[Canoe_Codger]

I got to tell you, Flagstaff is full of angry boatmen, tourists, and boaters. My company had to cancel a trip this weekend and it doesn't look good for my next trip. This is some bull sh...

Make it hurt.

Settled law. Hmm. It wasn't a week old, not even yet published in the CFR (at which time it actually becomes law) when it was first ammended. And it has been amended nineteen times since it was passed by both houses and signed by the President, all Democrats, with not one Republican voteing for it. The last five amendments were done by Presidential decree, not by Congress. That is NOT in the COnstitution which specifies the roles of the three branches of government. The biggie of those was the one that gave a one year delay on the employer mandate to large businesses.

As we have seen this past week, the implimentation is not ready for prime time with the websites crashing, poorly designed and hard to navigate. Few people have sucessfully signed up.

Security specialists are aghast at the lack of security for information given by citizens signing up. Both on the websites, and in person with "navigators". The navigators are by and large private contracted services. At least two of those were under fraud investigations before being given multimillion dollar contracts. There is no provision for the navigators to pass background checks, be licensed to the insurance industry and training is 20 hours of courses.

All of the personal information on individuals goes into a central database. Acessable by seven government agencies. John McAffee is apalled. You medical records, what prescriptions you take, all of your personal identification along with financial records.

An example from Maryland:

Should you decide to apply for health coverage through Maryland Health Connection, the information you supply in your application will be used to determine whether you are eligible for health and dental coverage offered through Maryland Health Connection and for insurance affordability programs. It also may be used to assist you in making a payment for the insurance plan you select, and for related automated reminders or other activities permitted by law. We will preserve the privacy of personal records and protect confidential or privileged information in full accordance with federal and State law. We will not sell your information to others. Any information that you provide to us in your application will be used only to carry out the functions of Maryland Health Connection. The only exception to this policy is that we may share information provided in your application with the appropriate authorities for law enforcement and audit activities.

It goes on:

If you send us an e-mail, we use the information you send us to respond to your inquiry. E-mail correspondence may become a public record. As a public record, your correspondence could be disclosed to other parties upon their request in accordance with Maryland’s Public Information Act.

So if you ask about an abortion, or about your VD, or about ED, or whatever in your email, it is now public information.

This is the tip of the iceberg. The 10,543 pages have now been published in the CFR. And reporters searching have yet to find a Congressman or Senator who has read it.

And small employers are positioning themselves to be least harmed by it's mandates by laying off employees, reducing employee hours and refusing to expand and hire additional employees. I can provide a small partial list. It is more than a couple.

When my brother and I were kids on the farm, we came up with some ideas that sounded brilliant at the time. Using a quilt as a parachute to jump out of the barn loft sounded great. Luckily the quilt passed me on the way down and I suffered no permanent damage. Fishing for hogs from the same loft with an ear of corn tied to baleing twine sounded cool too. And it was until my brother got yanked into the pen with the sow and her piglets. Looking back, it is a wonder that we grew up at all, let alone with just a few broken bones and stitches for our not-so well thought out ideas.

Michael