Looking for a tandem/solo Canoe

[jphif]

Hello all,

I'm in the market for a new canoe. I want one that is between 14-16'. I will use it to float mainly class I-II with the occasional III (Piney, Illinois Bayou, Buffalo, etc.).
I would like one that can be paddled solo with some camping gear because I'm planning about a 5-7 day trip on the buffalo whenever there is water, or maybe an overnighter tandem trip.

Here are some of the models I have been looking at:
--Buffalo 14' and 16'
--Two Brothers Arkota
--Two Brothers Brightwater
--Wenonah Prospector 15'
--Mad River Legend 15'
--Old Town Discovery 158
--Old Town Camper 15'
--Old town Guide

Are there any specific models anybody would recommend/avoid for the purposes I intend to use it for? I am especially interested in the Legend 15. Also, if anybody has a used one they would like to sell, I would be very interested.
Thanks,
Josh

[Cowper]

It’s kind of crazy for me to write a review of boats I haven’t paddled but hey, this is the Internet, so why not?

If your “to do” list includes tandem overnight trips, I’d avoid the 14’ models – they will be overloaded with two folks plus camping gear.

I have not paddled the Two Brothers canoes, but just looking at one on the top of someone’s truck I was favorably impressed. The lines looked good, the fit-and-finish looked good, to be blunt, better than the Buffalo canoes which I generally like as a reasonably priced, “do it all” canoe. So I would put those two above the Buffalo Canoes in your list. Between the two models – depends on what you want. My observations would be that the Arkota would be far better when tandem or paddling with a big load of camping gear due to it’s size; and probably faster due to its length. The big plus for the Brightwater would be that at 60# it will be noticeably easier to lift and move around than the 73# Arkota.

The Wenonah Prospector 15' will probably be the fastest of the boats you mentioned, making it a pleasure through pools, but a little less oriented towards whitewater. It will be fine on things like the Buffalo, maybe better than the other boats because the Buffalo has some long pools. Weight is also reasonable at 59#.

The Mad River Legend 15' seems to be designed for exactly what you have in mind. Compared to the Prospector, it weighs only 7# more; it will be a little slower in the pools, but a little better boat in the rapids. Neither of these two will haul the same amount of gear as the Arkota, but again all three are good boats, depending on whether you want to lean towards optimizing for gear capability, cruising the pools, or running the rapids.

Old Town Discovery 158 is heavy at 80#; you’ll notice that every time you load it. I don’t see any hull characteristic that is outstanding enough to offset this; if you can afford it and find one, get one of the other boats you mentioned.

Old Town Camper 15' – specs look good; haven’t had the chance to paddle one. Probably similar to the Wenonah. It may be almost identical, but if I had to gamble without the chance for a test paddle I’d go with the Wenonah simply because I’ve developed some brand loyalty growing out of the fact that I’ve never paddled a Wenonah that was a dog.

Old Town Guide – you didn’t say which length, but my answer is the same for both: Polyethylene boats are tough but HEAVY. Try to find one of the other models you listed that is a royalex boat. This speaks to why I’m not a huge fan of Old Town canoes, even though my dad was because the company existed since 1898: the company has a mix of really decent boats, and boats intended for the “entry level” market. Some companies just don’t make any bad boats; but Old Town has a mix of good boats and cheaper, heavier models I wouldn’t want, so you have to pay close attention to what model you’re looking at.

SO, to summarize: Avoid the poly boats (Discovery, Guide). For the rivers you describe; go with the Legend for best whitewater performance; the Wenonah or Camper for best performance in the flats, or the Arkota for mid-range performance with monster gear hauling capability. I’d also suggest looking at the reviews and ratings you find on paddling.net – If you read between the lines and look for those 8/10 and higher ratings, you can figure out which models folks are really excited about owning, and which ones think their boat is just “OK”.

These are just my thoughts; I’m hoping some others will chime in too because I’d like to hear more opinions.

[Al Donaldson]

Josh:

Since I have owned many of the canoes that you mention, I'll list them in my preference order:

1) TB Arkota -- possibly the best all around 16' river canoe made today. NOT for those who cannot paddle a straight line. If I had to have just one canoe for tandem and solo paddling, this would be the one.

2) Disco 158 -- the only other one with the load capacity that you need. WAY heavy, though and more of a lake than a river boat.

The 15' canoes will all be riding too deeply in the water, either tandem or solo (with gear) to behave well. A Camper 16 or a Prospector 16 would work, though. Neither comes up to the behavior and quality of the Arkota.

My Wenonah Prospector 15 (the LAST Wenonah I ever will own) also had some significant durability problems.

As much as I like the Two Brothers canoes, the Brightwater would run too deep in the water for tandem work (unless you and your paddling partner weigh 240# or less together) and would not turn well as a river canoe. (Now, as a solo flatwater small stream boat -- there is another story.)

My prejudiced opinion only. I favor canoes that turn extremely well, heel predictably and save my butt when I do something wrong. I really don't care how well they "track", how much they cost, how "politically correct" they are, nor how fast they are.

Regards,

al

[ckuntz]

Take a good look at Old Town Appalachian as well..

Chris K

[we66erno1]

Just wanted to chime in and let you know that a 16' buffalo canoe, made before 2008 is always gonna be a good bet. Make sure it has skid plates or you make sure you install 'em before you do any whitewater.

I've owned mine for 7 years now. I've floated almost every lazy river and creek with it. I've done full descent of the buffalo to the white. I taken my three oldest kids down the Ponca to Kyle's run, the Remmenl to rockport run, and a lot of other creeks and rivers. I've also soloed my boat down the Cossatot and run the Hailstone.

I don't have a saddle in my boat either. Just the two seats and two aluminum tharts. The Buffalo 16' canoe is probably the best all around canoe I've ever paddled. I did change out the carriage bolts for hardware that is easier to deal with.

Granted, I dislike heavy canoes in general though. And I love my Sunburst(thanks David reid). And I've only paddled discovery's( heavy boat, harder to damage though), buffalo's and Blue holes's. So my option may be a little biased. I've paddled with Torpedo and I'm very jealous of his Arkota. And that will be the next canoe I buy anyways.

If you get the chance to buy an old Buffalo boat from one Of the conssesionars for less then $400, I'd advise you do it. It'll be an ugly boat, but it'll treat you good!


One little disclaimer though. I kayak now, so you really can't let my opinion carry that much weight.

[TBC]

Id go with the Arkota!

[torpedo]

This may be a little late to offer my advice on a tandem/solo canoe but here it is anyway...

I have a Two Brothers Arkota, Blue Hole Sunburst, Blue Hole OCA Tandem, and an old school Mad River solo that is similar to the Caption.

The Two Brothers Arkota is my go to boat and I enjoy paddling it over any of the others, although I'm ashamed to admit that I still haven't paddled the Mad River.

The Arkota performs very well tandem even with significant weight. The only problem, and it's a problem you would face in any/most canoes is if you have someone that weighs more than you and is taller than you in the bow.

The Arkota also performs extremely well when paddled solo with or without additonal weight. It is a very solid and extremely reasonalby priced all around boat that is capable of moderate whitewater. I highly recommend it. Check with Two Brothers and see if they will let you try out a demo boat.

I really like the rest of my canoes, just not as much as the Arkota for the majority of what I paddle.