Creek boat volumes too high?

[Clyde hall]

Curious to get opinions on creek boat volumes. I am looking for a creeker, coming from an All-Star. I get that the two paddle differently but the volume in some of the new creekers seems awfully high. As a 6' 180lb yakker do I really need 74-80 gallons of volume? Seems to me like some of the newer boats have as much if not more volume than old school boats from 15 years ago!

[okieboater]

Many think volume in a creek boat is a good thing.

[Cowper]

How much volume you want will depend both on the types of creeks you want to paddle as well as your personal preferences. So 75 gallons could be either too much or not quite enough for you.

Some folks who are really comfortable thrashing around in even big holes in their play boat may want less volume and a little more edge on their creek boat, while others will want creek boat with max volume to keep them up on top of the water doing surface moves.

Some want a shorter boat for maximum turning; others will want a little bit of extra length for the speed it gives them on certain must-make moves.

If you do a lot of low volume creeks, shorter and thus less volume is probably going to be optimum. If you do medium volume or high volume creeks (mostly found out-of-state, not counting a few "flood" runs), then you will probably like some extra length, speed, and volume in your creeker.

I consider the volume an "interesting" parameter to look at after I've figured out everything else I'm looking for in a new boat. But before I ever get to that, I'm looking harder at other things like length, width, bottom shape and edges, and so on.

If you're local, take advantage of OOO to demo some boats; take them down to rockport and go for a spin to narrow down your choices.

[steve b]

Yup, high volume in a creek boat is a great thing.
If your running drops, volume should be just as important a consideration as other factors.
Maybe a typical modern creek boat is not what your lookin for. But I'll bet there are some new boats called creek boats out there that depart from the norm.
My first plastic boat was a Corsica S 10'6'' and 75 gal.
Current boat is a Fluid Solo Large 8' and also 75 gal.
Best of Luck

[Eric Esche]

Something to also consider is that when creeking, most folks want to take along some rescue gear and/or survival gear, that some playboaters do not make a habit of carrying and the extra length and volume to store that gear make a larger boat work better.

and the displacement hulls found on many creekers, both of old school and new design, tend to hang up less than boats with chines in shallow water ledges.

Easy rolling is another trait desired in a creekboat.

Just my thoughts at 3:40AM, from someone who hasn't done it recently or been there in a while.

Eric Esche

[Fish]

I'm 190 lb and paddle a LL Huck at about 69 gal. It works great for creeking for me, but there have been times when a bit more volume would have been nice to have. It does seem to get pushed around a bit on higher volume creeks (like in CO for instance). I like the short length of the boat for AR creeks and a displacement hull for me is a must. My dilemma now is that I am looking to get a new creeker and they don't make anything quite like the Huck anymore. I have paddled Dagger's Nomad both in the 8.1 and 8.5 sizes on class 2-3 water. The 8.5 is recommended for my weight range, but I'm not used to that much volume or length, so the boat seems really big to me. The 8.1 paddles well for me, and I think I may get that boat despite the mfg recommendation. I'm kinda on the fence about it right now tho. To go big or not to go big? Anyone out there paddle either of those boats and have some feedback in terms of paddler weight for each?

I do think that, in general, a creeker with more volume will help save your butt if you get into a bad spot (pinned, temp-pinned, big drop into shallow landing, etc.). However, make sure you the boat handles well and you can paddle it where you want to be, since if you can do that, you can avoid getting into bad spots in the first place.

- Fish

[neighth4n]

You should buy the biggest boat you can find.

[ckuntz]

Another thing to consider is the weight of the boat itself..
If you want a bigger volume creeker, some of them are a little hefty. That said, I love the Nomad but it weighs 10 pounds more than my Hero. Something to think about when you're hiking in or out. Most of the creek runs have some hiking to do and some are pretty steep..
Chris

[turboturtle]

Unless your huckin the narls, volume is a crutch!
Last time on Richland, I paddled a forty odd gallon boat.
Slalom boats are thirty gal. and do just fine.
My favorite boat is a squirt @ 20gal or smaller however, so take my advice with a grain of salt.

aka Bob

[justin.payne]

buy that villian mike p has for sale. Thats your boat and you know it

[mgood]

I once heard a story about a great boater who described his ideal creeker as something "long and boring."

If you're going to be creeking, you need volume and something that is predictable. If you just want to paddle richland and set the bar at that level, then volume may not be that important. You wouldn't really even need a creek boat unless its at high water. But if you think you may want to up your game one day and start hard IV's and get into some V's, then good volume is a must.

Demoing boats is a good idea, but make sure that you're paddling it in at least class III or an easy IV so that you get the idea of how it handles when you need it to. Creek boating is a ton of fun, but is significantly more dangerous than downriver play. Since it is, you want a boat that you can depend on when things go wrong, and I for one wouldn't ever want to be in a boat that didn't resurface quick enough for me to set up for the next move. You also have to think about pin potential- it's a lot easier to get yourself out of a big boat than a little one.

[Clyde hall]

As usual....great feedback from the ACC community. Thanks for helping me out. Still haven't decided. But demo'd the Nomad 8.0 and was not impressed. Going to try the Burn and something in the Jackson line.

[Eric Esche]

I used to paddle a Lettman MkIV and then a Hollowform Riverchaser on creeks, but that was admittedly a long time ago. Savage Skreem was next. (Susan has it now and says it is HERS.)

Tried out a Dagger Green Boat last week on a flat water demo, and have to say, it was love at first stroke. (Thank you Ozark Mountain Trading Company for letting me try it out) It just felt right towing someone in. I'm old skool, but I think it would make a great creeker. Has volume, has speed, has good water shedding, felt like it would roll easy, and it's fitting was adjustable enough to fit me, and it cut and turned exactly like I like a creeker to handle.

It might suprise you if you check it out.

Eric Esche - not that I am buying another kayak right now.

[okieboater]

Having done the exact kayak routine Eric did (except for the Green Boat, but I still have and paddle my Response 11ft 3 inch similiar to the Green) I will second his comments.

[BMuu]

To me for creek boats volume is a very good thing, but you must compromise between volume and maneuverability of a smaller boat.

I have been paddling a Jackson Fun for 3 years, for stuff like Richland I was happy running it in the Fun.

For the Russell fork gorge in VA I was happy to have the extra volume of my diesel 75. (75 gallons) I'm 180LBS + gear

In the diesel the water feels smaller than in the Fun, but I have to work a little harder to hit my lines in the diesel though due to the size and weight of the boat compaired to the fun.