Study on white water parks for Louisiana

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KAYAKN

Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by KAYAKN » Mon Aug 04, 2008 7:12 pm

Not getting anywhere so i'll delete the dang thing
Last edited by KAYAKN on Wed Aug 06, 2008 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Ryan Viser
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by Ryan Viser » Mon Aug 04, 2008 9:56 pm

Hope you wrote her back and told her heck no those rivers aren't dependable. Hope you told her that around here we have to spend major gas money to go up and paddle rivers that come up 10% of the year. I would welcome a water park that's closer than Charlotte. Paddling is a great sport, it just sucks buttcrack when you get to the point where you don't even feel like a paddler anymore because there's no consistent water around here.

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RomanLA
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by RomanLA » Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:56 pm

Lake Charles recently got a ton of money for lake front development. I considered bringing up the idea of a whitewater park. After further thought, I realized it would end up being a swirling mass of tubes and beer cans. We have a lazy river at the casino near my house. I wonder how they would feel about me kayaking in it. I'd be willing to rent a room for the night! lol

Trismegistus
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by Trismegistus » Tue Aug 05, 2008 7:49 am

Shame that what nature has to offer is never enough to satisfy our recreational wants. What Louisiana lacks in vertical drop it makes up for in bayou paddling -- check it out: Bayou Paddling.

Of course paddlers certainly aren't above diverting groundwater, leveling forests and grasslands, erecting huge rebar and concrete water tanks, installing enormous noisy, energy-consuming pumps, and displacing wildflife and flora in order to spend a few hours playing some waves. No indeed. You build it, they will come.



P.S. Does not anyone see the irony/hypocrisy of using the Ozark Society -- a society supposedly dedicated to the preservation of wild and scenic rivers, wilderness, and unique natural areas -- as the conduit to solicit support and interest in such an endeavor? Has the world gone mad? Will we ever learn?

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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by Trismegistus » Tue Aug 05, 2008 9:40 am

Thanks to the moderator who edited my post. :roll: Twas a Freudian slip perhaps or maybe simply stating what we all know to be true.

Either way -- whether it be censorship or whitewater paddling it all be "exceedingly exciting or stimulating"... :)
Last edited by Trismegistus on Tue Aug 05, 2008 10:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

tomcat
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by tomcat » Tue Aug 05, 2008 9:59 am

heck yea....if they can build snow ski slopes in Qutar....why not build whitewater parks in Looziana. I'm sure that the 10 or so local paddlers justify the concept. :crazy:

Butch Crain
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by Butch Crain » Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:00 am

In Adam's defense, I'll just say that it reflects his (and that of young people in general) enthusiasm for an activity we all wish we had better access to.

Just hope the "Society" will think it through though.

Not to mention if a whitewater park includes any portion of churning up the waters of the Red, I for one wouldn't want what's in the bottom of that river washing over me to any great degree. It's a beautiful venue for a paddle camping trip, but considering it's drainage area, no telling what's in the sediment.

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Fish
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by Fish » Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:43 am

To read this thread, one would think that whitewater parks are some kind of environmental bogeyman. But it's not like those things are generally built in pristine wilderness settings. Most (if not all) parks are in or very near urban areas, places where highways and shopping malls will always far outnumber whitewater parks. Actual wildlife displaced by such parks: some incredibly small amount. Actual environmental damage from such parks: very small compared to most other activities. Energy consumption of a pumped whitewater course: about the same as couple days of driving for paddlers in a couple of SUV's .

So, from a practical standpoint, it's hard to see parks as some kind of real menace to the environment, though it no doubt sounds good to some folks to argue that point for the principle alone. Such argument is generally much easier than actually getting involved in stopping serious threats to real riparian environments (possibly like dams, gravel mining, deforestation, etc.). I suppose it's fine if you want to use whitewater parks as a symbol of environmental abuse, but it sure would be nice to see those same folks at public hearings and rallies when it comes time to take on real problems.

Just sayin,
Fish

Butch Crain
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by Butch Crain » Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:51 am

Fish, I think you make several excellent points.

But the question remains: should a "conservation" organization ever devote its energies to development of any sort?

It's a little odd for a group that generally is against using habitat restoration tools like prescribed fire to be for recreational development like a whitewater park.

But then Adam's post didn't say that this was necessarily a Society initiative. The person inquiring just happened to get his name from the Ozark society website.

KAYAKN

Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by KAYAKN » Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:53 am

Thanks Butch for the defense comment :D Thats all we really want is to be able to have soom fun in our back yard. I would have to agree with ya on not wanting to see whats on the bottom of the old Red.

Tris, I dont believe i ever said anything about the Ozark Society ever being involved in anything about a ww park. Its just a college student doing a report, nothing more.

Tris, about your comment about "have we all gone MAD" Not yeat but im getting there. Tris if ya ever need a shuttle driver i would be more than HAPPY to give ya a ride.

Tomcat, we have 12 ww paddlers :lol: :lol:

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Fish
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by Fish » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:01 pm

Yeah, I gotta agree it's quite strange if the Ozark Society is interested in this. Not sure that's the case, but this is definitely not something I'd expect them to be checking out at all.

- Fish

Trismegistus
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by Trismegistus » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:59 pm

Yikes -- I never implicated the Ozark Society only that it was being used as a "conduit" -- in this case to gather the names of folks who might be interested in such a project. I truly believe the Ozark Society would be opposed -- or at least neutral -- if they had to take a specific position on this project. My apologies for any misunderstanding.

Secondly -- as to the statement "Actual wildlife displaced by such parks: some incredibly small amount. -- Tell that to the plants and animals -- yes grand scheme, no big deal; but at the local level, pure devastation. Living in an urban setting -- right smack dab in the middle of progressive west Little Rock -- I can provide numerous examples of what has happened to our local environment -- loss of vegetation and animal habitat, non-point pollution, invasive flora, etc. In fact, acre for acre some of the land adjoining our fair city provides a far richer, more diverse environment than that found out in rural Arkansas -- it's not immune nor any less precious.

Too often we separate private land from public land or rural landscapes from urban landscapes -- these distinctions are arbitrary -- nature knows no boundaries. Ideally we should treat our yards with the same care and consideration we give to rural countryside -- in fact, I'd argue that we should treat our local surroundings better. And at the very least we shouldn't use past development/pollution/environmental harm as a rationale to support more of the same. Like the old saying -- "think globally, act locally".

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RomanLA
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by RomanLA » Tue Aug 05, 2008 1:22 pm

In defense of parks in general, look at what climbing gyms have done for rock climbing. As much as traditional climbers tend to be against them, they have done wonders for the sport and many people have made the jump from gyms to crags. In fact, gyms are the biggest source of new climbers.

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Fish
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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by Fish » Tue Aug 05, 2008 2:04 pm

Trismegistus wrote: Secondly -- as to the statement "Actual wildlife displaced by such parks: some incredibly small amount. -- Tell that to the plants and animals -- yes grand scheme, no big deal; but at the local level, pure devastation. Living in an urban setting -- right smack dab in the middle of progressive west Little Rock -- I can provide numerous examples of what has happened to our local environment -- loss of vegetation and animal habitat, non-point pollution, invasive flora, etc. In fact, acre for acre some of the land adjoining our fair city provides a far richer, more diverse environment than that found out in rural Arkansas -- it's not immune nor any less precious.
Sure there are all sorts of plants and animals that live in urban areas, but they are already in an environment that is not wild/rural. The displacement of urban dwelling animals and plants by a whitewater park in an urban area does not an environmental catastrophe make, does it?

Sure, if you "ask" the animals and plants, they'll disagree. You're right on target there. Shall we also inquire with the grass that is displaced by our gardens, the insects that are killed by our windshields, and the deer being shot by hunters? They're all probably really pissed off with us, but that doesn't mean those are environmental problems by any means.

Again, when trees and animals in the city are threatened, usually a lot of folks show up to protest. But when far larger numbers of trees and animals in far wilder and more remote places are threatened, it's hard to get people to pay attention, let alone show up there. Just my experience from ten or so conservation projects in the past ten years. Hope that's not the case in the next issue I'm involved in.

- Fish

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Re: Study on white water parks for Louisiana

Post by David Mac » Tue Aug 05, 2008 2:42 pm

I for one wouldn't have much use for a whitewater park if ir was further away than one hour's drive.

Sure I'll drive three or four for a day of real whitewater (Cossatot, Richland), and eight or nine for a whole weekend (Ocoee, Nanty) but for someplace that is the L.L. Bean version of a theme park? Not far at all.

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