Need some wetsuit advice from gals

[justanovice]

When we bought our kayaks for Christmas, my intentions were to wait for warmer weather to paddle. However, I simply can't wait!!! I have been looking at wetsuits online, and the options are completely overwhelming. There are short ones, full-length ones, two-piece ones, different thicknesses, different styles. I need some advice from those of you who have used one and loved or hated it. What are the best brands, types, etc? I am already a cold-natured person, so a wetsuit is a must. I don't plan on paddling outside of the state of Arkansas, and I doubt that I will do a tremendous amount of paddling during winter. My eight-year-old son will need one too. As always, any advice is always welcome.
Sandy

[Cowper]

I'm not a gal, but the answer really isn't that different for guys vs. gals.

A good discussion appeared on our gear forum not too long ago:

http://forums.arkansascanoeclub.com/vie ... =3&t=16832" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You probably said "wetsuit" because that is the best known cold water gear, but if you're really cold natured, you should consider a drysuit or a wetsuit "Farmer Jane" style, plus a drytop.

A visit to Ouachita Outdoor outfitters is also recommended; in 30 minutes they can probably give you the same amount of information that it would take me 2 or 3 hours to write down.

To put things in perspective, here's what you will probably be thinking 3 minutes after you go in the water on a 45 degree day:

With no paddling gear: "I hope these people can rescue me!"
With a wetsuit: "I hope these people will build me a fire!"
With a drysuit: "I hope these people didn't take any pictures, this is embarrrasing!"

[DeBo]

Ok, what Cowper said is true. I will say that I am cold natured also and I could not live without my dry suit for whitewater. The drysuit will work for a lot of different temps, you just need to have several different weights of fleece you can wear under it. Be sure to get women's sizes and maybe get a size larger than you might think, in order to get on more layers if you need. Be aware that in a drysuit, you will need a relief zipper in order to pee without having to take it off. You can choose a "male" zipper in the front and use a "Freshette," which is basically a funnel and tubing, so you can pee like a man. (This is what I have.) or you can get a dropseat which allows you to still pee like a woman.

Wetsuits are OK and cheaper but it's still really cold if you take a swim. A good compromise is the wetsuit farmer Jane for cool days and add a dry top and fleece for colder weather.

I also paddle a lot of flat water in the winter and for that I just layer up in fleece with a rain suit on top if needed. On these trips I carry a complete change of clothes in case there is an accident and a dry box with firestarter.

[jackatspa]

Sorry I'm not a girl. But I may have some good input. Remember the thicker 3mm-5 mm is going to keep you a little warmer but it's going to feel a little more bulky. I have a large farmer Jane wetsuit that I bought for my girlfriend but it's not he right size. It Is used but in great shape. My lady friend said you are welcome to have them. And I have a pair of NRS splash pants size Med that your son is welcome to have, I just got some new pants so I will no longer need them. They are in good shape and always kept me warm. Just use a good baselayer and some board shorts with them. I'm in the Hot springs area. Just shoot me an E-mail if interested Jackjhollingsworth@yahoo.com


Jack H

[Jim Krueger]

(Wife posting on husband's login.)
Have had 3 NRS wet suits: shorty, 3mm Farmer John, and 3mm Farmer Jane Ultra. Much prefer the Farmer John to the relief zipper in the Jane Ultra. The Jane Ultra has a zipper from the lower front all the way around to the back. Convenient only if you are a contortionist. If you are wearing long johns under your wet suit, you not only have to deal with wetsuit access but also long john access and get the two coordinated. With the farmer john, access is from the front and about waist level to slightly lower, so the coordination is much simpler than with the much lower access of the Jane Ultra. Jane Ultra would be ok if you didn't wear anything underneath--not my preference. Ultra seems warmer to me than the standard wet suit, and I run hot anyway, so the Ultra is not my choice. Perhaps a John Ultra would work if you are cold natured. Jim likes BARE brand wetsuits for their construction, but you will probably have to find a dive shop or order on line to get a BARE.
Marlo Krueger

[okieboater]

Be aware that if you take a swim in a "wetsuit" you are probably going to get cold water seeping between the wetsuit and your body. Which will cool you down pretty fast.

Had a bud take a fairly long swim on a January Big Piney run. He was in a wet suit and paddle jacket with fleece top etc.

We got him out of the water but he was past the cold stage, just shaking uncontrolled. There was a number of kayakers there. We got wood and a big fire going and collected various bits of clothing from each other's dry bags. Even in front of the fire in the wet suit, his shaking was getting worse. Eventually we stripped him down put all the dry stuff we could find on him and he finally stopped shaking and warmed up. We kept the fire going big time. Took a while but we dried out his wet suit neoprene, got him suited back up and paddled non stop to the take out to keep his body warmth going. He ended up ok.

The message here is even tho you have a farmer john wetsuit and paddle jacket on, a long swim is gonna put you in hypothermia.

I have had several swims in farmer johns and dry top and that combo worked pretty good.

I have taken several swims in my dry suit with thick fleece bunny suit and not a big deal

So if you plan to boat in really cold water, my advice is to get a dry suit.
Next best would be the farmer John and dry top as the dry top will not seal perfectly to the neoprene but it will keep a lot of the water from leaking in.

Last choice would be a paddle jacket and wetsuit as that combo is the minimum cold water setup I recommend.

As always, a nice neoprene skin divers hood that comes down over your shoulders is key no matter what else you wear. The little neoprene caps or to a less degree the fleece ones help, but the hood is the best.

Dry suits can give you false security. My little CPR incident happened when I had on a dry suit but just a regular helmet on a below freezing float. The water was so cold on my face and neck I went into an almost instant muscle spasm and cut off the windpipe. Maybe the divers hood would have stopped that, not sure, but since then I wear the dry suit and divers hood. Also I have a couple size larger winter helmet so the neoprene fits inside.

Hands also go to sleep in the winter. I use the neoprene hot hands pogies. Some use gloves, I like the ability to feel the paddle shaft and extra flexibility I get with the hot hands. a thin neoprene glove inside the hot hands pogie might be a good deal I just have not tried that.

More than you wanted to know and in addition to all the other good stuff.

If you swim in really cold water without the right gear on, you will soon be at the mercy of the river and hope your buds can save you cause you will be helpless a lot quicker than you think.

I also encourage boaters even kayakers to carry some extra fleece along just in case!

[bmartin]

You are getting sage advice and besides dollars it is tough to argue against a dry suit, but there are days when a wetsuit is just fine. Lots of factors to consider such as water temp, wind, sun/clouds, remoteness, etc. but a wet suit is fine and may be preferrable for temps above 60 or so. Really depends on whether you want to paddle on colder days which in AR are pretty often when the creeks and rivers are running. Ideally you want a mix of wet suits, tops / splash jackets, and a dry suit so you can gear up to suit the conditions and it takes a while for most people to accumulate the gear and figure out what works for them on any particular set of stream and weather conditions. There is a lot of trial and error and a common topic on the drive to any put in is what gear everyone is wearing and invaviably many will make last minute adjustments right before they put on the water.

Since you asked about wetsuits, I'm not a big fan of wet suits thicker than 2 or 3mm around the arms and shoulders. You do not get much more warmth with thicker suits but get a more noticable restriction in movement. If a 3mm will not cut it, time to go with a dry suit or dry top IMO.

[Cowper]

While I think all the advice being offered is valid, I'm begining to have some "sideline" observations about this thread:

1) In spite of dramatic gains made in the last decade, there's still more guys paddling than gals

2) This thread is laying waste to the myth that women like to talk more than men. We just enjoy talking about different things! (like cool toys/gear to buy, vs. how we feel about it)

[justanovice]

Too funny, Cowper!! I originally posted this toward females because I thought the discussion might be gender-specific. Apparently not. It all sounds like very valuable advice, and a drysuit definitely sounds like the most efficient. However, every purchase I make has to be multiplied by three (my two kids). I may start with Farmer Jane/John style wetsuits and get drytops, paddle minimally during colder months, and build up to drysuits as my finances can handle it. Hey, is this support or what? My husband is considering buying some gear as a Valentine's gift. Sounds perfect to me. It will definitely last longer than chocolates, roses, or a fancy dinner!!
By the way, is anyone back to the UALR pool yet. My daughter and I went last Saturday just to observe and learn, but the pool was closed.

[Cant_sit_still]

about the ualr pool i was told. look for Joe Tarver to post on the ACC board .(maybe this weday)

[littleredboat]

Better late than never? lol! I am an open-boater, and I have kids, that enjoy expensive shoes for their various sports. lol. That being said, I hate dropping a ton of money on stuff for myself, that I'm not going to use all year! I started out with wet suits, and let me tell you..... cold and wet. And if you DO have to happen need to use the bathroom, SHEESH! So after a couple of years of that I started researching, I try to NEVER flip, lol, but you know, messing around it's going to happen. I have 2 splash pants and a dry pant, two are NRS and one is Soloquist (nice knee padding in those) And two soloquist tops, one dry and one spash, that I got a killer deal on. I wear fleece underneath and I'm as warm as can be. I've tested out all of them, but jumping in and floating down the river a ways, a little trickle sometimes around the ankle, but usually dry as a bone. I make sure everything is cinched up tight, and it works pretty good. Now, when I first started out I was DETERMINED to not be a sissy and get a dry suit. lol. I actually wore wool sweaters and wool pants (don't ask. I looked like a sheep). But after spending plenty of time in the water goofing off, I decided it would be worth looking into some dry stuff. lol.