kayak problem...help, Opinions please.

[Clif]

We did some Buffalo today. Lots of current in the section at the level we did. My kid is doing much better making his Crossfire go where he wants it to. I had him aiming at spots and trying to get there, learning the push of the current. Step before hitting the eddies.

At our last break stop, to dump the water he ate on a wave train with his skirt off, he got in my RPM max. Seemed to have better control of it and he liked it. Said it was quicker and more responsive.

So... 1st, I can't spring for no new jackson or anything. I need some ideas and/or offers to try or what to try. Q is 11, 90ish pnds and about 4 foot 8. Boat suggestions or anything would help. We are pretty much down river.. not much play. A different boat might change that. He is just starting good in other words.

[BEubanks]

The smaller the boat, i.e., one that matches his size, weight, strength, the easier it will be for him to move. For down river trips, an old school boat like a Dagger Blast is long but would be small enough for him. Not a lot of old school (cheap!) kid boat options, but find something that matches his size and the hull design won't be as critical.

My oldest started out with a locally made kevlar/glass boat (age 9 I think). Don't know if any of those are still around. Then moved to Dagger Blast, then to Eskimo Kendo, then to LL Skip. 2nd daughter still in the Blast, but probably time to move her to something else.

With kid paddling it's hard to keep buying gear as they grow, but it's essential to have gear that is properly sized for them to really enjoy paddling and to build the skills they need.

My 2 cents.

Byron

[turboturtle]

A friend turned me loose with a Perception "SPIN" to market at dirks today. it's a way cool boat that if not sold soon, I might have to buy it. Two-Fifty and it it's yours. I should have it at Rockport next weekend barring any unforeseen circumstances. I'll try and post a picture tomorrow if your interested.

Bob

[mgood]

Just throwing this out there- I learned to paddle in a crossfire. And I paddled that boat for years. My dad and I were running the Nanty in a Mirage and a Crossfire for a while (before it became cool again to paddle longboats). My suggestions- first, keep the crossfire. It's not the easiest boat to paddle ever, but there are soo many things you can learn very well in it. Second- check out eddyflower.com. It's a good website that has all of the major companies of the past twenty+ years and their boat designs, plus reviews. Some possible boat choices, given your description: Wave Sport Kinetic, Riot Showbiz, Pyranha Inazone 220, Pyranha Acrobat 275, Perception Whiplash, Perception Whip-It, Perception Mr. Clean (he may need to grow into this one), Perception 3D (i highly recommend this one), Necky Jive, Eskimo Kendo, Dagger Dynamo (this may be the best fit). Some of these are still easily available- some may be hard to come by ( I know where you can pick up a 3D for the right price). I suggest narrowing down your picks to a top 5 and look to get one of them.

[msisco]

at 90 something pounds he's at the light limit of the weight for the crossfire, fairly high volume boat. i had one for years an loved it, of course i was closer to the 170-180 lb range too. he'll probably like it way more next year after he puts on some size

[Clif]

T-turt, pics please. Or you can send to cqa at windstream dot net
Will this boat be happy downstreaming it? We are getting into the 10 milers and such. Thinking of getting him on the Piney soon. Test drives will be the ticket here.

thanx for the input guys

[Cowper]

Very interesting that a 90 pounder is liking a "big boy" boat (200+ big boys) better than a crossfire. But it makes sense when you think about the details hinted at in your post.

What has happened is, you're giving him "homework assignments" that favor "long boats" - go fast in a straight line, point A to B, no leaning, no spray skirt required.

For that assignment, his success and thus his positive feedback is of course best in the longest boat, and it doesn't matter too much that the boat is too big for him to effectively edge (lean), if he is flopping around in the seat, or has no effective knee contact to help control the boat.

The perception Spin offered would be a great WW boat for your boy, BUT, unless you change the homework assignments he will like it even less than the crossfire because it is shorter.

Homework assignments that will start to give the Crossfire (or Spin, or other relatively shorter WW "short" boats) the advantage will include eddy turns, peel-outs, paddling a figure 8 around two buoys, going through a gate, turning and coming back through, and my favorite, SURFING!

He's eleven. Let's just do it - bring him to the pool in July and we'll teach him to roll. That skill is critical for more serious WW, and while not required for recreational touring, still a very cool tool for a young boy to have in his bag of tricks.

[Clif]

The "homework" wuz just something we were doing while drifting down. That and some games of chase. I see much improvement each trip in his control in the shoals. Lately tho, I have been on the raft or canoe and not able to say, "like this."

You think he can roll the crossfire? Attending some pool sessions will hafta happen.. we talked about it yesterday, to let him get in other boats as well.

[msisco]

think he can roll the crossfire???!!!??, its about the easiest rolling boat ive ever been in,, granted i havent been in THAT many different boats, as long as he has hip braces he would probably be rolling it by hand in no time

[Clif]

In respect to him being slightly under the crossfire's weight range....is why I ask. Many folks told me it would be a good first boat, that reason being on the list. Easy to roll. I was kinda s'prised he thought my boat was better.

[turboturtle]

Clif this 'Spin " is just over six foot long. I don't think it's going to be a good runner. It's more play friendly than anything. I work here at the Student Center at UALR and store most of my boats here. If and when you could make it to the pool, Your son could try out all of them and then figure what might be better for him that way. The Perception is pretty flat and am not sure how fast or slow it is as of yet. The only pic I have right now is on my phone. I could send it to yours if that is possible. Just p.m. me you phone number if so. I will take a couple pics this evening and try to get them to your E-mail in the next day or two.
I forgot to mention that it comes with a Mountain Surf skirt. Which makes the boat even cheaper.

I did take the foot block out so I could try it on. I could barely fit in it. It'd be like me getting in a fun 1 or 1.5. Lol But if I get it to Rockport I might decide to keep it for myself. Toss a couple of softballs up front and heat it up a little for some foot room.

[Clif]

The old "sumbody else prolly knows more than daddy" thing is at play here. Planning to get to the pool in July so he can try other boats and work with other people. I will holler back when we can.

[Shark Attack]

sumbody else prolly knows more than daddy"

I know where you're coming from. You can always come by and pick up Lance's small Ammo any time Q wants to try it out.

Wes

[turboturtle]

If you let me know when you might come to the pool I will wurk with him for a bit as opposed to him ignoring you. If he dis's me I'll have him swimming in a second! :roll:

Bob

[GutIt]

Good choice, Clif.

A husband should not teach his wife, a father should not teach his son the technical aspects of boating.

I have seen more failed attempts at this than I care to remember and to date, all of them ended with the student never setting foot in another kayak. Now I’m not saying it is guaranteed, but there really needs to be a degree or two of separation to start.

Then? After a roll is happening, or at least being learned, some River “Homework” is being completed successfully, it will then fall to you to impart that all-important Zen and the Art of Boating! And that is the important part! Give your Son to the Teachers and then let him come back to you. A lot of them in this environment who can, and would be willing to do this. I can almost guarantee that you will both be happier for it!

As far as a boat? I may have something you may be interested in. PM.