Question about NOC

[Boofaholic]

Im w/ Spanke on this. I boat w/ a lot of class 4-5 boaters and NONE have had any formal instruction. In fact most self taught boaters will tell you to just paddle w/ someone better than you and pay attention,youll grow plenty fast.Save that cheese on the formal course and youll be able to take many river trips on that dime! Find a solid crew willing to bring you up right and paddle as much as possible! Youll find you are constantly picking up on skills and progressing anyway. The only limiting factor is your desire to get better and the # of days you spend on the river. However, if you are just really needing to blow xtra cheese you can donate to the "move Joe and Amy to Cali" fund and help us to continue our progression!

[Jeremy M]

I agree that a lot of great boaters have become so without any formal training, but that is what works for them. But not everyone out there is a "watcher/doer". The only reason I bring this up is that people learn differently. Some from watching people better than they are and some from taking a "formal" class. For some people to learn and progress they need a structured environment and a stepwise process. This is not a bad thing. For those people that need/want instruction, places like NOC, etc.. and the ACC provide it for them. And for those that just want Super High Intensity Training, its great that there are folks in Arkansas willing to show newer boaters the ropes, sans a formal environment. Both are reasons that I love boating in Arkansas!!!

As long as you keep smiling, you're doing something right!

[Heath]

John, Not trying to persuade you different, but. I live in Texarkana and would be happy to help or give pointers in any way i can. The LMF will be running alot this summer. You can develop and learn anything you need to move up there. Rockport will also be running this summer, lots of good boaters there and a great place to learn as well.

I here the NOC stuff is great. and if you feel you need that kind of instruction then go for it. as others have said time in the boat will work wonders, time upside sown in the boat will do even more.

later Heath

[rublelvr]

Thanks guys and gals for all the input and suggestions. I am very thankful you have taken the time to answer this post. Looks like I need to HIT THE WATER!!! Heath, thanks for the invite for some personal coaching I will most definitely being taking you up on that although as I have watched your posts on ACC your work situation will certainly be more flexible than mine I will be relegated to a weekend warrior type of paddler if you know what I mean!:)

[Boofaholic]

Heck yeah, an excellent offer by Heath already! Id take him up on that one for sure! Free instruction from an excellent boater, ya cant beat that! I didnt mean to discourage instruction, I am just cheap and think that if you want it, and you can find it free from a good boater then thats the ticket. Besides, as a CSCS I think there is nothing as effective at improving skills as on the creek instruction.(this is as sports specific training as one can get IMO)Which will allow you to build kayaking specific strength, river knowledge, and all skills within the set simultaneously!Provided that the creek chosen is reasonably within your skill level/comfort zone. Have fun & good luck!

[mgood]

Just gonna say it- I'd take instruction from Heath over a hotshot NOC instructor any day of the week.

I'm also going to back up the notion of putting the money elsewhere- you can always get better gear (or gear for colder weather) or use it to finance shuttle (or a mountain bike, if there happens to be a lack of shuttle). Just plan to paddle as much as you can at the Mountain Fork- its a good river for the lack of credit its given, and you can learn a lot on it. Rockport is also a good idea, but if I were you, I'd stay with the LMF and once you get confident move up to the Middle Section of the Cossatot.

Paddle with people you trust and recognize as being good paddlers, and try to learn as much as you can.

[Renee H]

Yes, I'd vote for Heath as an instructor He got me into boating and showed me the ropes and let me tag along with him when I was still living in Shreveport. He is a patient teacher too

[T Yamashita]

I'd still recommend formal instruction over going out with the buddies. The learning curve may be tougher if you're just learning and trying to figure out new creeks too. It's also hit and miss so you're not sure of what the progression of skills is. Also, a certified instructor is someone who has taken the time and effort to get to a skill level and has the motivation to teach and can focus on your development rather than getting out for personal enjoyment. In formal instruction you hit things over and over so you get the full range of teaching styles and maximize your learning and confidence pretty quickly. You get years of experience from the instructor, demonstration of skills, exercises to take home, and skill practice in a few days that might take several seasons to develop. It's also a good chance to travel to paddle and learn what class III means in the east vs. class III in the west.

The people who posted here are good/excellent boaters and can most likely get you going, and that may be all you need. Paddling with good boaters will get your skills up too. A lot depends on who you are. If you're someone who reads up, watches instructional dvd's, and goes out to practice every week or so, you may not need formal instruction as much as someone who only paddles when the water's up. Also, It may be that the learning curve for kayaking is not as tough as open boating. Most of the folks I've seen who've learned open boating on their own seem to be hit and miss on their skills.

Just some random thoughts, ty

[Heath]

[quote="T Yamashita"]I'd still recommend formal instruction over going out with the buddies. The learning curve may be tougher if you're just learning and trying to figure out new creeks too. It's also hit and miss so you're not sure of what the progression of skills is. Also, a certified instructor is someone who has taken the time and effort to get to a skill level and has the motivation to teach and can focus on your development rather than getting out for personal enjoyment. In formal instruction you hit things over and over so you get the full range of teaching styles and maximize your learning and confidence pretty quickly. You get years of experience from the instructor, demonstration of skills, exercises to take home, and skill practice in a few days that might take several seasons to develop. It's also a good chance to travel to paddle and learn what class III means in the east vs. class III in the west.

Ty brings up very good points, and for some this may be the best way for them to learn.
I am by no means an instructor, just someone willing to help if possible.
several of the people on this board helped me a lot as i was starting, and I am just trying to do the same.

The lmf is highly overlooked by most on the board. if you want to learn your river running skills it is the place to be in the summer. if you really want a good work out drive to pres falls and put in at the top of the chute. paddle to the rereg from there you can atain every rapid clear to the dam, then paddle back down and play at the falls.

I cant stress enough on how atainment moves have helped improve my boating.

thanks for all the props guys(and gals)

later Heath

[T Yamashita]

Didn't mean to step on any toes. Heath and all the guys that help out folks with river moves, strokes, etc... are great, and I would second the notion of doing attainments. Just saying that the learning curve can be tougher if you're on your own.

ty